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320rwekfpl
Evil Incarnated

Registered: Jul 2002
Location: In the woods(and playing banjo)
Posts: 217

i hope we agree on that one, that's that mastering the gate system has nothing to do with tech advancement. esp. since all that knows how to master the system either have to knowledge from building the thing(ancients), from the ancients(nox, furlings, asgard, tollans), theft from the ancients(or one the ancients taught) and theft from the goa'uld.

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Old Post 12-15-2002 03:53 AM
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_.:?nubis:._
Man of less sorrow

Registered: Sep 2002
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quote:
that's that mastering the gate system has nothing to do with tech advancement
It does if you're isolated and cannot thieve the tech from the ancients or the goa'uld

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Old Post 12-15-2002 03:55 AM
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320rwekfpl
Evil Incarnated

Registered: Jul 2002
Location: In the woods(and playing banjo)
Posts: 217

But it's impossible to deciphre it without at some point using one of those sources for information. The best you could do if your lucky is something like the mission to Abydos. Otherwise the Goa'uld would've struck at the Asgard homeplanet(that isn't known to them). All it would take for them is to infect a single Asgard and the Asgard would be out of business.

The point is, if there was any logic or natural base for the navigation through the gate system(which there isn't(proven in "the fifth race")) then the Goa'uld would've have found the Asgard homeplanet...

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Old Post 12-15-2002 04:09 AM
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_.:?nubis:._
Man of less sorrow

Registered: Sep 2002
Location: Apologising to all the members who i called idiots.
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What if u could travel to other worlds and find their stargate, knowing that u would be able to create a program that random dials stuff. And to get to the az'gard homeplanet one needs knowledge of the ancients to increase the power to the gate, it has nothing to do with co ordinates...

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Old Post 12-15-2002 04:17 AM
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320rwekfpl
Evil Incarnated

Registered: Jul 2002
Location: In the woods(and playing banjo)
Posts: 217

?nubis:
First, to get to the Asgard homeplanet one needs extra energy for the gate, not knowledge of the Ancients. I pretty sure the Goa'uld would be able to master this. It's only a question of coordinates...

Second, creating a program that randomly dials planets. Well, since there are some limitations in the speed the gate dials it would take eons to complete that. Then there's the limitation of the dhd too. So... There's no way that a species could deciphre the gate system without having to spend tens of thousands of years on it. The only civ we no of that has existed for so long is the Asgard(circa 30000 years ago they were at our level, which would give them at least another 10000 as a civ. 30000 years might be enough time to deciphre the gate system trying out a possible combinations). Look at the human computers of today... It would take one of those longer time than that to deciphre a 8 character random char password....

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Old Post 12-15-2002 04:37 AM
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Kamakazi Casper
Baaaa. Down Sheeba.

Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Out keeping the fish in the liffy well fed
Posts: 3588

You're both right, you need the device O'Neill made in the Fifth Race, but he needed the knowledge of The Ancients to build it. However, the Goa'uld have ships that could easily get to the Asgard's home planet (if they knew where it was and wanted to, the Asgard are a lot more powerful than they are). I don't think the goa'uld have the knowledge to make a device to add power to the gate though, so they can't randomly dial planets, which in itself would take forever. There are a huge number of possible combinations (for 8 glyph addresses - 10,295,472 possibilites if my math is correct) and planets with Stargates and who's to say the Goa'uld even know, or think the Asgard are in another galaxy or want to go after them?

quote:
Hmm, perhaps there was some misunderstanding with my phrasing let me try it again, It would be foolish to assume that a race sprawled out all over the galaxy had a single form or writing which they used the entire time they were in our galaxy.


You haven't answered the question. Why is it foolish?

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Old Post 12-15-2002 03:14 PM
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Lord ?okar
Supreme System Lord

Registered: Aug 2002
Location: Necropolis
Posts: 621

Hmm, perhaps there was some misunderstanding with my phrasing let me try it again, It would be foolish to assume that a race sprawled out all over the galaxy had a single form or writing which they used the entire time they were in our galaxy.
No misunderstanding; you are incorrect.

The reason humans are still stuck on this little rock is because of our nations, religions, languages and our divided governments. This is the reason for the dark ages, and for our relative technological inferiority.

Since the Ancients are human, they would therefore suffer from the same impedements. For a human race to become as advanced as the Ancients were, they would have to amalgamate their governments, relinquish their religious beliefs and recognise a standard language. Only after pooling their efforts would they be able to get along enough to reach that level of technological enlightenment.

Last edited by Lord ?okar on 12-16-2002 at 01:41 AM

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Old Post 12-16-2002 01:10 AM
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_.:?nubis:._
Man of less sorrow

Registered: Sep 2002
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Lord sokar, i was talking to KC, to make an example you can actually understand i'll bring it down to the earth level, there are several very distince and somewhat different dialects of the italian language and italy is very small as far as countries go so put it on the trans galactic scale and try it out. And the advancement of a species isn't determined by whether they work together or not, to say so is foolish, i believe RH said this in a previous thread: Some of the greatest technological advancments are made during wartime. Now forgive me if i'm wrong but isn't the point of war that u aren't working together, that in fact, you are working against each other, now if your theory is correct during war time we would have technologically regressed, why didn't we then? And thank u KC for helping clean up that mess of threads that weren't going anywhere.

quote:
Since the Ancients are human,
other threads have pointed out, quite clearly, that this may not be the case, although i believe it to be so basing your post on it would be an error in judgement.

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Last edited by _.:?nubis:._ on 12-16-2002 at 02:52 AM

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Old Post 12-16-2002 02:49 AM
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Lord ?okar
Supreme System Lord

Registered: Aug 2002
Location: Necropolis
Posts: 621

somewhat different dialects of the italian language
Yes well there is a large difference between different dialects and different languages. Your example is meaningless because Italians are not an intergalactic species (correct me if I'm wrong).

technologically regressed
Where an entire nation is united by the will to survive, then they advance. But one can only go so far with the resources of part of a planet.

If a species like the Ancients were to enter an intergalactic war, they would obliterate each other. And that is not how the Ancients left.

other threads have pointed out, quite clearly, that this may not be the case
Then other threads are wrong. We KNOW the Ancients are human.

Last edited by Lord ?okar on 12-17-2002 at 02:01 AM

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Old Post 12-16-2002 05:52 AM
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320rwekfpl
Evil Incarnated

Registered: Jul 2002
Location: In the woods(and playing banjo)
Posts: 217

Well, Carter could backwards engineer that extra power source and help other dimension Carter to build another so, given that the Goa'uld are a couple of hundred years more advanced than the Tau'ri, I think it's right to assume that they can build it. The reason for not building it might be that they don't know that they can dial out of the galaxy. But anyway, that pretty much the same thing...

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Old Post 12-16-2002 08:42 AM
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dr.taz
Apple Sauce Bitch!

Registered: Sep 2002
Location: Camped out in front of the telly
Posts: 747

Well all the Carters did was get it to work again. I suppose a lot of back-wards engineering goes into that but they still had a previously working example on their hands. the goa'uld have no such device and, as yu said, no knowledge of such a device. So I don't think that the goa'uld could engineer one on their own even if they wanted to.

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Old Post 12-16-2002 02:33 PM
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Jaffa, Kree!
Moderator

Registered: Oct 2001
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 2928

I'll let you decide for yourselves - do you want this thread split into seperate discussions? (as there are a few diverging from topic, i've noticed, in just one page), or should i just ask you to get back on topic?

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Old Post 12-17-2002 12:48 AM
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320rwekfpl
Evil Incarnated

Registered: Jul 2002
Location: In the woods(and playing banjo)
Posts: 217

You might as well close the thread, since it's getting nowhere...

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Old Post 12-17-2002 05:09 AM
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_.:?nubis:._
Man of less sorrow

Registered: Sep 2002
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Posts: 843

Thead splitting for me if u like JK, this convo ain't gunna finish and this thread would be shut a long time ago if we hadn't gone way off topic.

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Old Post 12-18-2002 01:45 AM
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Lord Yu
Member

Registered: Dec 2002
Location: China, Earth
Posts: 86

Here's a good question. Why do the tokra enter a host differently then the goa'uld?

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Old Post 12-19-2002 09:31 AM
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